Despite our occasional ideas to the contrary, the racing scene in eastern Nebraska is pretty small; pretty close-knit. We know each other very well - perhaps too well. We know each other's strengths and weaknesses and tendencies. We know how to get under each other's skin.
But by and large, it's a pretty friendly population. Think about the Nebraska peloton as a whole and try to count how many people you really, truly dislike. I only have two on the list. But I'll still be friendly when I see them. You don't have to like people to be polite.
With that closeness in mind, a discussion popped up a few days ago that was so beyond the norm for our little community that it bears examining.
Synopsis:
Ian Robertson, of Lincoln, went to the U.S. Masters national track championships and won a race. There's a masters 30-34 category, in which Ian raced. So, hooray for stars and bars, even though he's Canadian.
He posted a note on Facebook, got a few congratulatory notes and likely moved on with his day. But then the magic word showed up: sandbagger.
Sandbagger, with the implication that masters races weren't for a rider of Ian's caliber - he regularly finishes in the money of Cat. 1/2 races. Sandbagger, as in he's taking money intended for somebody else.
You can imagine what kind of shitshow that started.
I've won two races in my entire life - they were both running races when I was 27 years old. Both were very hard to win. In the first one, I came on strong in the last mile and took the guy at the end. In the second, I went from the gun and simply ran away from everybody.
But that doesn't mean it was easy. And I guarantee Ian's win wasn't easy. Winning is never easy - that's why so few people get to do it. I savor those two running wins, because it might not happen again. Ever.
I've seen a few masters criteriums in my time as a bike racer. They're not easy. Take the masters race in Papillion a few weeks ago. Four Cat. 1/2 guys beat the bunch into submission and rode away. Think that was easy? Were they sandbagging?
No, because they fit into the criteria for competing in the race: they were aged 40 years or more. Ian fit into the criterion for his 30-34 races - he's between 30 and 34 years of age. That was the only stipulation. There was no "between 30 and 34 but not if you're a cat. 2 racer or better."
It was just "between 30 and 34." So Ian raced. And he won. I see no problems with that. Moreover, I fail to see how anybody else could have a problem with that.
What say you, Nebraska?
24 comments:
A few words come to mind - unfortunate, stupid, small minded, embarrassing for Team Kaos and our sponsors. Lou.
Lou, if you're referring to me those are my personal opinions. Nothing to do with sponsors.
I think Master's 30+, 40+, and 50+ fields can be very tough. At criteriums all over the country, guys jump from those fields right into Pro 1/2 races and do very well.
I haven't read the Facebook commentary Bryan alludes to here, but racing one's age category--especially at the national level--is perfectly honorable. Here's an analogy: should a 22 year-old Cat 1 NOT race the Under-23 national championships?
ahhh the "S" word...
Eric, To your question I answer " it depends"? My coaching philosophy doesn't allow sandbaggers in my stable. Also, racing two race, especially a 40+ guy/gal, they aren't going to do spectacular. That is not what's going on here.
Bryan, You just proved that winning can be easy with the example of Papio crit.
Ian's ego, which he himself admits to having a large one, is to big for him and it's blocking his thought patterns.
I'm not a super coach as he so eloquently says, amognst other defamation of character he and Jason mention, but I have my principles. Everything I say and do is based on truth.
In that example, it may have looked easy, but the effort wasn't easy. I talked with the boys afterward. Did you?
Bryan, that depends on what you mean by effort. Ok, you have more specifics than I do on that race that weren't pointed out.
A win can be easy. If you were to race Lance he would drop you like you had a broken back or something.
There's a lot of pro's 1,2 that jump into masters races and blow the doors off some guys who lifestyles don't dictate training at a top level.
Oh Boy!
Wouldn't you say, though, that by and large the guys who do masters races know what the score is?
The only determining factor is age. There's no categorization or podium-finishes limit. It's just, "how old are you?"
How many masters races has Spence won around here? (Sorry to bring you in, too, Chris.) Is he sandbagging it?
Chris could very well be sandbagging. Again, it depends. This time part of the "depends" relates to " what is his goal".
Ian is to be congratulated for his Masters National Championship. I applaude you Ian! We haven't had too many National Champions here in Nebraska. Let alone on the track. We should be proud. Don't let that go to your head Ian.
A National Championship event such as this is set up to determine who in the 30-34 age group is the best at that given discipline. It just so happens that we lump this age group into Masters...
Don't get me started on local masters races though...That is another whole can of worms.
No no no - let's get it started. We can discuss without freaking out. Or at least I can. Better to talk about it than have years of passive-aggressive crap built up, no?
Coach, I would agree and disagree on your comment who's the best in age group racing. It is left up to the discretion of the athlete to participate but if he/she is sandbagging his potential then personally I don't agree he/she should be in the race.
I would, as a coach, never recommend an athlete ride a race that doesn't fit their long term goals. My coaching philosophy carries over from my personal philosophy.
Bryan, I will no longer discuss this in a forum such as this. It takes a very open minded, cool, calm, collected, non judgemental, secure, confident individuals to have discussion like this over the internet. For some it works for others not.
If anyone wants to know my coaching, and thus personal philosophies, on bike racing/training we can talk. Yes, I will do email marc@trainingtherightway.com
i like that episode where cartman signs up for the special olympics
"Timmeh Tim,Timmeh Timmeh:
'Jimmeh?'
Jimmeh:
'Timmeh TimmehTimmeh, Timmeh!'
Timmeh, Jimmeeehhhh....'
Jimmeh:
'"Timmeh, Timmeh TimmehTimmeh, TimTimmeh'
Timmeh Timmeh!"
- Timmy explaining to Mr. Mackie his confrontation of Jimmy for using Steroids. Classic.
Interesting... let me comment from a different perspective -- the one looking up from the bottom (aka Cat 5-land). Earlier this year, I decided to give crit racing a try. I hate to drive 1.5+ hours to do a 30 minute race, so I decided maybe I would do the Masters and Cat 5. Some would say that I was an "in-over-my-header" (the opposite of a sandbagger). So I asked a couple of aquaintances who were registered for the race what they thought of having a Cat 5in their master's field. Both gave an enthusiastic, "It's an open field, register... race!" I look at a Cat 1/2 in the master's field the same way: it's an open field, race! If I don't want to race against a higher Cat, I shouldn't be entering an open race. The beauty is this, though: I'm never going to be a 1/2 or probably even a 3; this is my chance to race against some. So bring it on, Mr Robertson, et al. While you're racing for that meager Master's payout, I'll be counting my success based on how long I can hang and how many times you lap me...
As a Masters racer (45+) who is basically a cat 4+, here's what I think about Cat 1/2 guys racing in the Masters category: just because you can, doesn't mean you should. I mean, I don't Tilford doing it. On the other hand, props to you for being that fast because there's only one way to get there - the hard way.
About Ian Robertson's deal: it was a Masters National Championship - if he was sandbagging (and I do not think he was), then there were likely 20 other guys just like him in that race, so I think his victory is legit. Ian, props to you, sorry this has become an issue.
1) Congrats to Ian
2) Masters racing is some of the toughest races I've ever done.
3) Call me a sandbagger for racing Masters at Papillion. But like Glen, I wanted an extra 45 minutes of effort.
4) If you have an issue, take it up with our wonderful governing body, USA Cycling. Don't hate the playa, hate the game.
Thanks for the (almost) unanimous support guys! Gives me much more faith in Nebraska cycling to hear!
Next up is Canadian Nationals (this time racing masters because according to the UCI I HAVE to race Masters ... )
Thanks for all the support (on both here and my FB page) ... I've been keeping a low profile in this discussion to see how it plays out naturally.
--Ian
I, also, want to thank my supporters. I've always had faith in Nebraska cyclists and all cyclists.
I also want to thank my parents, my private school education, my grandparents, my brother, my favorite dog and many more both human and non human who taught me to be open minded, patient, a teacher, a learner and voice my opinion and not hide in the shadows.
As an example of who and what I am, my French grandfather I admire with the utmost respect and idolize for his stalwart opinions. He was imprisoned in a Spanish prison by Franco's regime. Later he was deported back to France.
I'm thankful for the good men and women of the military fighting for my rights. We all know that without them this world would struggle for even half of those rights. Yes, that includes Canadians and green card carrying Canadians.
To conclude, it's interesting how everyone gives their own personal examples relating to themselves. Every situation is different. In Ian's case I call "sandbagging". It's also interesting that nobody is asking why I believe this.
I'm coming late to the party, but I just want to mention another facet of the sport. Women. We deal with this every day. For us, the fact is that once we get out of cat 4, we are thrown to the wolves with the pros. We rarely, if EVER, get the opportunity to race in masters categories. The very thing that you guys are talking (or complaining) about happens to us every single time we roll up to the line. We hate it, yes, but we don't complain about it. It's hard for me to listen to conversations like this without remembering our situation. Fact of the matter is that the rules are set up, and we all work with them. We train as much as we can, and we do as much as we can. The rest of the time we just want to ride our bikes. I'd suggest we stop with the name-calling, finger-pointing, petulant pouting, etc. and just go ride.
I might also point out that a sandbagger is a person without a true specific plan/goal.
Instead of using "sandbagger", more of a cycling related term, how about I use underachiever. Would that calm everyone's nerves?
No.
Beer? Tranquilizers?
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